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Statue on Mars? New Images and Commentary

Basically, we started out with this 2004 Spirit panorama image. Then we resoluted it to 1200dpi and started looking at it.

First, we killed the Martian colors for a version of 'false color'. This brings out better detail and contrast to the image. Remember, Mars isn't Earth and you have work with the lighting a bit to get a realistic view of what you are actually seeing.

Closer shot of the anomaly. We think this is the best view. It just doesn't fit with the terrain. Imagine our surprise when we found this right in the middle of composing an article to DEBUNK the story. Then everyone got serious...

This is the best we could do with this one. We don't know what it is, but we think NASA needs to make 'Spirit' do an about-face and take a second look.

NV user 'iuonuocon' pointed us to some individual NASA images, and we downloaded this one. It's inconclusive, we think. It's probably made of stone, yes. But does it REALLY match the surrounding terrain, as he says it does? We think not. You must judge for yourself.

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It just happens that AB has been downloading Mars Exploration Rover images since day one. When we heard about the 'statue on Mars', you can bet we were skeptical. We opened our 134mb image of that particular Spirit panorama shot, fully prepared to enhance, expand, debunk the whole thing.

Well, as Gomer Pyle used to say: 'Surprise, surprise, surprise! Gee, Sergeant Carter...I see somethin' in that picture I can't explain!'

Exactly.

What is it? We don't know. We have some thoughts, but right off the top of our heads we think NASA should have Spirit do an about-face and head back to the same spot for another picture.

Just in case.

We worked on the original image for quite a while. We avoided any enhancements to the images except those involving contrast or lighting. When a picture gets transmitted a hundred million miles across space, it's okay to use digital tools to enhance close-ups. But only the ones that are fair.

The picture is disturbing. The figure differs significantly from the surrounding terrain. It doesn't seem to fit. Sure, it could be a trick of the light and all. However, it convinced us enough to change the back cover of the next issue of our magazine - at the last minute. We don't usually do this sort of thing, but the image is interesting. It teases, it makes you wonder.

Old thoughts about 'where did we REALLY come from' surface again. You never know.

Haven't you ever been curious about how mankind just happened along in the last couple of million years and still managed to take over the planet?

I mean, that's damn quick, a nothing blink in the total stretch of geo-time that life has actually existed on Earth.

Makes you wonder, anyway. Who knows? If we find pyramids on Mars later, then we'll know.

No one here claims to know one way or another WHAT the images represent, or what they actually show. We will tell you that we enhanced them carefully and gently from an original that we know is legitimate.

The rest you can judge for yourself.

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{"commentId":1391957,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

What is it? Well, there are only TWO real answers. It is either a natural phenomenon or it is not.

I won't EVEN pretend to try and tell you. We just did the pictures.

{"commentId":1391957,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
  • 4 votes
Reply#1 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:40 AM EST
{"commentId":1392008,"authorDomain":"eddiefrench"}

Robert,
I am pretty sure that you know of the 'Low Gravity' effect on friable rock. Wonderful, surreal sculptures abound :¬)

{"commentId":1392008,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"eddiefrench"}
  • 1 vote
Reply#2 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 7:33 AM EST
Reply
{"commentId":1392370,"authorDomain":"Spaman"}

It's interesting..... whatever it turns out to be, and comments about

Haven't you ever been curious about how mankind just happened along in the last couple of million years and still managed to take over the planet?

... are the sort of questions we should be asking rather than deciding we know all the answers....

What if we find spaceship spares, if we ever get to Mars

{"commentId":1392370,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"Spaman"}
  • 2 votes
Reply#3 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:04 AM EST
{"commentId":1392491,"authorDomain":"chasing"}

Looks an awful lot like the old grainy image of Bigfoot, to me, frankly. Now we know where he hangs out when he's not scaring campers.

{"commentId":1392491,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"chasing"}
  • 8 votes
Reply#4 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:40 AM EST
{"commentId":1392542,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

When I started writing this article, I figured the pictures from the media were photoshopped crap that would quickly be debunked by enhancing the original picture and finding nothing there. I can't tell you how surprised we were when we saw this in the picture. I was already making notes on how the whole thing was bunk. Then...we saw it clearly.

Eddie: Low gravity what? I don't think low gravity has much to do with shaping stones. The anomaly stands out starkly from everything else in the image. It doesn't fit the surrounding terrain at all.

{"commentId":1392542,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
  • 6 votes
Reply#5 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:57 AM EST
{"commentId":1392581,"authorDomain":"eddiefrench"}

Robert, sorry but it surely does.
It means that delicate, 'top heavy' and elongated structures, that would collapse under Earth's gravity long before the interesting shapes took form, can develop under a lower gravity.
You have surely seen the effects of this on the weathered 'layering' on lots of the Spirit and opportunity pictures sent back. I have seen 'impossible' undercutting caused by blown sand and finely balanced extrusions sitting there on many pictures, This is due to the weaker gravity exerting lower stresses on the rock.

{"commentId":1392581,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"eddiefrench"}
  • 5 votes
#5.1 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:07 AM EST
{"commentId":1392634,"authorDomain":"acidreflux"}

The single largest factor in erosion on the Earth's surface is a process called mass-wasting, which is mostly driven by gravity. We would expect to see unusual features that cannot form here on Earth under differing levels of it.

{"commentId":1392634,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"acidreflux"}
    #5.2 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:21 AM EST
    {"commentId":1398466,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

    Oh, I'm not claiming to know what it is. Like I said before, I just created some pictures. A closer view by NASA would likely put this to rest. I've narrowed it down to two possibilities, and they are 'maybe' at best. ONE: Strange natural rock. TWO: Partially completed sculpture. Number one, by the odds, is much more likely.

    {"commentId":1398466,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
    • 4 votes
    #5.3 - Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:49 PM EST
    {"commentId":3819421,"authorDomain":"corperateties"}

    Don't expect anything honest from NASA! You would be just another wide eyed child with the inability to see through the lines.

    {"commentId":3819421,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"corperateties"}
    • 1 vote
    #5.4 - Sat Nov 1, 2008 12:10 PM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":1392865,"authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}

    Christ, didn't anybody learn anything from the whole "Face on Mars" debacle? Is our cultural memory that friggin' short? Allow me to deflate some of the hyperbole-- it's the shadowed portion of one facet of an irregularly shaped rock, which just happens, to our minds which are hardwired to see patterns in everything, to look a bit like a statue.

    If you want to see things like it, you can see them in plenty of rock formations here on earth.

    Why anybody would be surprised by the effect simply because the rock is on Mars instead of here at home is anybody's guess.

    {"commentId":1392865,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
    • 10 votes
    Reply#6 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 12:28 PM EST
    {"commentId":1394082,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

    iarnuocon: The 'face on Mars' was taken from space. This one was taken from maybe a hundred yards away, and I don't see anything in your linked image that says definitely it's just a shadow...even WE did not try to say it was not natural phenomena. We just don't know.

    {"commentId":1394082,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
    • 2 votes
    #6.1 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:21 PM EST
    {"commentId":1394180,"authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}

    I think it's pretty obvious that it's just a shadow, and there sure isn't any reason to think otherwise. This is the equivalent of seeing a face in the outline of a cliff (such as at Old Man's Cave in Ohio) or in a cloud (such as this summer, when I saw the flaming skull of the Ghostrider in a cloudbank over Columbus). I'd be willing to bet that I could comb that image and come up with at least one other shape that I could claim as the "outline" or "image" of something human, and it would be exactly the same sort of thing-- the human mind putting a familiar pattern on insufficient information. I've seen smiley faces and the Disney "Mickey" silhouette in craters, the outline of the Madonna sketched by the stalk of a yucca plant, and Jesus' face in a piece of toast. While all those things (and this one, too) were interesting, they were interesting because of what they say about the human mind, not about smiley faces, Mickey, the Madonna or Jesus.

    You can keep right on "not knowing" whether this is a natural phenomenon. Until you put a whole lot more on the table than the passing resemblance to a somewhat anthropomorphic figure in a small portion of a photograph full of irregular shapes, I'm going to go waaaaay out on a limb, here, and say there isn't anything particularly strange about this.

    I'd love to think that there are Martians, and that somewhere over the horizon lie the lost cities of John Carter's Barsoom, but this sure as hell isn't evidence of it... or anything, for that matter. It's a Rorshach blob, and some people are reading way too much into it.

    It's a natural phenomenon.

    {"commentId":1394180,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
    • 4 votes
    #6.2 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:53 PM EST
    Reply
    {"commentId":1394296,"authorDomain":"nearing"}

    Nice catch! Very intriguing.

    Do we think NASA will explore this further?

    {"commentId":1394296,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"nearing"}
    • 2 votes
    Reply#7 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 7:32 PM EST
    {"commentId":1403947,"authorDomain":"atonhunter"}

    I think the correct question is "do you think NASA will try to obfuscate this further."

    {"commentId":1403947,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"atonhunter"}
    • 1 vote
    #7.1 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 11:35 AM EST
    Reply
    {"commentId":1394400,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

    NASA is a waste of money. We have people who complain about defense spending begging for more research on Mars just because a rock looks like Bigfoot. What a sad day.

    {"commentId":1394400,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
      Reply#8 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 8:07 PM EST
      {"commentId":1394663,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

      I refer TJ Thompson to my previous article from August, 2007:

      'Ten Reasons We Need NASA'

      The only way I can respond to some of the other comments about the anomaly being simply 'a shadow' are demonstrated by the photos posted here. We were working with the original image from 2004, which in its printed size would be about five feet wide and two feet high, if you made a poster from it. Being a 134mb image, it was not that difficult to get good detail from such an image. Does it resemble a shadow? We think not.

      I could have posted up larger, even more detailed cuts from the main image, but Newsvine image restrictions make this difficult. You can only go about 500 pixels wide here for an article, maybe a bit more. I've always wished Newsvine would allow images across the entire page, with text added at bottom or top if necessary.

      AB of Seattle has changed it's back cover for the February issue of Escape Velocity. We present the best picture of the anomaly we have there, and let people decide for themselves. We are also using full-page (A-4 size) images inside the mag along with an article. We don't make judgments here. We just present what's available.

      One point we brought up: Time for NASA to address this issue. This isn't some shadowy shot taken from a hundred miles out in space, but a very detailed shot taken from a short distance, and shows something that just doesn't match the terrain or substance, even remotely, of anything else in the picture.

      {"commentId":1394663,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
      • 4 votes
      Reply#9 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:31 PM EST
      {"commentId":1401686,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

      And I refer Robert Blevins to the concept of a free market. Certainly private industry can do more with space than we can, and I only believe that we should send things out into space for the purpose of communication technologies (i.e. satellites). I do not believe in interplanetary travel. We have still so much left to do with this earth that God gave us stewardship of. Do we really want to sieze more land that we don't do anything with? I believe that God is far away, and considering our tortoise-like speed of space travel, we might be able to go past the moon sometime next millenium. Anyway, we would never be able to find other people. They exist. But God is wise and put them far enough away that we will never find them and destroy their society, or let them destroy ours. Regardless, earth is our home, and we have done a fairly lousy job protecting this planet, so why go beyond it and dirty up even more of God's stuff?

      {"commentId":1401686,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
        #9.1 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 5:02 PM EST
        {"commentId":1404165,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

        TJ Thompson says, in part:

        "Certainly private industry can do more with space than we can, and I only believe that we should send things out into space for the purpose of communication technologies (i.e. satellites). I do not believe in interplanetary travel."

        I get a little discouraged when I read this sort of stuff from a young man. (I looked at TJ's column avatar, to get an idea of who would say this. He seems like a normal enough guy.) The urge to explore has always been a part of man's basic nature. There have always been people who pushed the outside of the envelope, to find out what is beyond the known, and to explore the unknown. This 'drive' may actually be genetic in some ways.

        And I don't believe God put the stars in the sky just to pretty up the view on summer evenings. Carl Sagan said once: "For man to believe he is the only intelligent life in the galaxy is selfish indeed..."

        You are espousing a philosophy that has been used by some in previous generations, under different circumstances. If these people had their way, the earth would be flat and the sun would revolve around it. Columbus would have stayed home. Magellan would have become a fisherman, and Neil Armstrong would have gotten a job giving flight lessons in Ohio.

        On the more practical side, Earth is running out of space for people and the resources to support them. Right now there are about 6.6 billion people on the planet. By 2042, that number will have increased to 9 billion, and it gets worse after that. Space may not be able to save us from overpopulation, but it may help provide new resources. It's a little early in the game to tell, because I consider Earth to be barely out of the Stone Age of space exploration.

        I don't mean this in a bad way, but I actually feel sorry for you. If you were an old guy, I wouldn't. When I read your comment, I thought back to being in the fourth grade at that Catholic school in Oregon and getting rapped on the knuckles for turning in sci-fi stories thinly disguised as 'essays'. And yet, I didn't stop doing it.

        Then I see a young guy sticking his head in the sand, pretending nothing exists except Earth, and it is truly a big bummer.

        On a matter of point, many of the Apollo astronauts, for example were big believers in God, and became more so once they saw Earth from deep space, realizing we were just a small bit in a really big place. Maybe you HAD to believe in God to volunteer to have yourself strapped to the top of a rocket holding thousands of gallons of high-octane fuel...

        {"commentId":1404165,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
        • 6 votes
        #9.2 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 12:49 PM EST
        {"commentId":1404454,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

        We are far from all there is in the organized universe, but to imagine that God would put us close to another inhabited planet is silly. God knew that we would harm our own planet. Why would He want us to ruin another societies' apostate views with other planets that might be more obedient.

        {"commentId":1404454,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
          #9.3 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 3:12 PM EST
          Reply
          {"commentId":1394691,"authorDomain":"silkmesh"}

          If you look at the total picture you can see many odd features, such as a possible trail of mice foot prints. A soldier complete with berry. I wrote an article making fun out of these natural shapes of a low gravity planet. The area looks is part of a lava flow, just before the larver cooled a metorite or vocanic rock has hit and splashed fast cooling lava the splash solified in the low gravity forming this larver statue.

          Like Mercury and the Moon, Mars appears to lack active plate tectonics at present; there is no evidence of recent horizontal motion of the surface such as the folded mountains so common on Earth. With no lateral plate motion, hot-spots under the crust stay in a fixed position relative to the surface. This, along with the lower surface gravity, may account for the Tharis bulge and its enormous volcanoes. There is no evidence of current volcanic activity. However, data from Mars Global Surveyor indicates that Mars very likely did have tectonic activity sometime in the past.

          Mars' orbit is significantly elliptical. One result of this is a temperature variation of about 30 C at the subsolar point between aphelion and perihelion. This has a major influence on Mars' climate. While the average temperature on Mars is about 218 K (-55 C, -67 F), Martian surface temperatures range widely from as little as 140 K (-133 C, -207 F) at the winter pole to almost 300 K (27 C, 80 F) on the day side during summer.

          http://www.nineplanets.org/mars.html

          Of course if your for the silly side of life then please visit my silly article

          {"commentId":1394691,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"silkmesh"}
            Reply#10 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:38 PM EST
            {"commentId":1394728,"authorDomain":"silkmesh"}

            sorry lava not larver, lol

            {"commentId":1394728,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"silkmesh"}
              #10.1 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:50 PM EST
              Reply
              {"commentId":1394786,"authorDomain":"bigmomma"}

              Can anyone tell how big this object is? I think I saw somewhere that it wasn't very big.

              Also, how can I get one of your magazine's?

              {"commentId":1394786,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"bigmomma"}
              • 2 votes
              Reply#11 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:06 PM EST
              {"commentId":1394965,"authorDomain":"Naomii"}

              check out www.xfacts.com

              There ARE pyramids on mars. This statue creeped me out. I totally believe it. Because the shadow on the statues lap below the arm is there.... I'm an artist and I know enough about shadows and light.

              Never trust NASA though. It stands for "never a straight answer". Of course they know about this, they just don't want to release it to the public so people don't freak out.

              {"commentId":1394965,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"Naomii"}
                Reply#12 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:09 PM EST
                {"commentId":1414440,"authorDomain":"sphinx"}
                Never trust NASA though. It stands for "never a straight answer". Of course they know about this, they just don't want to release it to the public so people don't freak out.

                This sounds like Transformers meets National Treasure meets The X-Files.

                I just went to xfacts.com and.... I'm sorry, but I just had to laugh. The title starts out with "Ancient Astronauts," and I took a college course about a year ago which expressly debunked and examined such frivolous, fantastic claims. To think that I'd meet someone who wholeheartedly believes in the stuff that the course told me some people believed is at once amusing and depressing.

                Next, you'll be telling me that the Egyptians had landing pads for spacecraft with mica reentry heat shields, an Aztec emperor went to space atop a rocket, and the Nazca lines were landing strips for alien spacecraft.

                {"commentId":1414440,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"sphinx"}
                • 2 votes
                #12.1 - Tue Jan 29, 2008 2:58 PM EST
                Reply
                {"commentId":1394973,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                Calculating from the total size of the image, and using the Rover itself as a size reference, I would say it is about 3-4 feet tall at most.

                Rottlady: Can't answer the magazine question. Just talking about it was skirting around with the COH. We're not difficult to find, though.

                You really have to like the commenter previously who was comparing a hard image taken with very high-res cameras to seeing Jesus in his toast...

                Right.

                For iarnuocon to state that the anomaly is absolutely, positively, a shadow, rock, or a trick of the human brain makes as much sense as say...seeing Jesus in a piece of toast. The truth is, no one knows for sure, but someone is going to find out.

                The 'Face on Mars' is a bad comparison to this image. That was taken (as I said previously) from a hundred miles out in space, while this image was taken from no more than a hundred yards away. Unless shadows can magically project themselves UPWARD and appear on an image, I don't see how it can be a shadow.

                Some have shuffled off the anomaly to 'low-gravity effects of erosion'.

                Okay. Maybe. But if this were so, why is this anomaly the ONLY one of its type in the same area? In fact, the reason people noticed it wasn't because their mind was 'playing tricks on them'. They noticed it because it is so much different than the surrounding terrain. It just doesn't match at all. It stands out glaringly as something POSSIBLY not natural.

                Time to send 'Spirit' back for a second look. That is the only way to tell for sure.

                {"commentId":1394973,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                • 4 votes
                Reply#13 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:10 PM EST
                {"commentId":1394989,"authorDomain":"bigmomma"}
                I would say it is about 3-4 feet tall at most.

                Thanks.

                Time to send 'Spirit' back for a second look. That is the only way to tell for sure.

                I agree, I wonder if there is a plan to do that?

                I found the web site....I can take it from there.

                {"commentId":1394989,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"bigmomma"}
                • 1 vote
                #13.1 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:16 PM EST
                {"commentId":1395127,"authorDomain":"silkmesh"}

                Robert there is no doubt that this is a solid object, I feel this is more likely to be a natural event involving a fast cooling lava flow, the object is seemingly at the edge of the flow. If the lava had been splashed the splash event would of solidified quickly that is if the atmosphere temperature was around about -55 C, the lower gravity would also slow down the event to allow the quickly solidifying lava to form the shape of the object.

                Looking at the object it seems to be at the back but on top of an embedded rock of which could be the culprit that caused the splash. also if you look at the lower right hand corner at the back of that rock you will see what possible could be part of that splash. The interesting thing its the same color as the object in question.

                I also expect the large rock now embed in the lava bed was projected out the erupting volcano the source of the lava flow.

                {"commentId":1395127,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"silkmesh"}
                • 3 votes
                #13.2 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:58 PM EST
                {"commentId":1396823,"authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}

                • No one here claims to know one way or another WHAT the images represent, or what they actually show. Seriously, Robert. Do you actually expect us to believe this? You've obviously selected an option which you think is at least plausible enough to require rerouting the rover to take another look. It's all over your article and your subsequent posts

                  Statue on Mars?
                  The picture is disturbing. The figure differs significantly from the surrounding terrain.
                  where did we REALLY come from
                  Haven't you ever been curious about how mankind just happened along in the last couple of million years and still managed to take over the planet?

                  and so on and so forth. You've reached a conclusion, and you're selling it, even if you're doing so in carefully veiled terms (hey, everyone! I can't name my magazine, but we're selling pictures!), and giving lip-service to skepticality. Well, I'll call your "skepticism" for what it is-- blanket credulity.

                • The 'Face on Mars' is a bad comparison to this image. That was taken (as I said previously) from a hundred miles out in space, while this image was taken from no more than a hundred yards away. In terms of the size of the image we're considering, the resolution is about the same. You've mentioned more than once that this is a "high resolution" image, and if you're referring to the overall picture of which this fragment comprises much less than one percent of the area, you're probably correct. But this little spot you've honed in on? It's all of 200 pixels square. The "Statue" itself is only about 30 pixels by 40 pixels. That's not "high resolution" by anyone's book. That's one reason why the "Face on Mars" is exactly applicable. Even worse for your argument, seeing faces and human figures in nature is a known phenomenon, as I mentioned, and as you simply dismissed with a wave of your "skeptical" hand. People are always seeing "meaningful" things where meaning doesn't exist. We're wired for it. Lowell and the canals of Mars. Hoagland and the "Face on Mars." You and this rock. These things have everything in common with seeing Jesus in a piece of toast, or the Madonna on the side of a building. It's no different from seeing the Old Man of the Mountain, Jesus' face in an ultrasound, the Virgin Mary in a grilled cheese sandwich, or a human skull on the moon.
                • Unless shadows can magically project themselves UPWARD and appear on an image, I don't see how it can be a shadow. Seriously? That's the story you're going with? That the shadow is "projected upwards"? Because what I see is a shadow falling downward and to the left, from a light source that is behind, above and slightly to the right of the rover, nearly directly overhead. And that fits in well with the other shadows that can be seen all over the photograph. Here's where you can look at the individual photos that make up this mosaic. Look for the panoramic images from sol 1366 thru sol 1369.
                • why is this anomaly the ONLY one of its type in the same area? Are you kidding me? The only thing that makes this "an anomaly" is it's putatively anthropomorphic shape, which is arguable, at best. You look at that photo, and "the anomaly" seems totally in line with all the other rocks and shadows in the photo. There's nothing "anomalous" about it.
                • They noticed it because it is so much different than the surrounding terrain. It just doesn't match at all. It stands out glaringly as something POSSIBLY not natural. I'm sorry, but that is simply bull@!$%#. Even with your helpful arrows directing me to the spot, it still took me a moment or two to find it. It "stands out" about as much as any marginally noticeable rock. What I'd really like to do is get a hold of some 3-D glasses, and take a look at the anaglyph. I imagine that would be a helluva lot more revealing at this resolution than your 2-D images above.

                I'll say it again, and maybe it will sink in: I'd love to think that there are Martians, and that somewhere over the horizon lie the lost cities of John Carter's Barsoom, but this sure as hell isn't evidence of it... or anything, for that matter. It's a Rorshach blob, and some people (including you) are reading way too much into it.

                {"commentId":1396823,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
                • 4 votes
                #13.3 - Thu Jan 24, 2008 1:28 PM EST
                {"commentId":1398392,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                iarnuocon says, in part:

                He quotes the article: "No one here claims to know one way or another WHAT the images represent, or what they actually show." Then says this: Seriously, Robert. Do you actually expect us to believe this?"

                I have NEVER said I knew what the object is. That would be ridiculous. No one knows, not for sure. Not even iarnuocon. Yet, when I voiced this simple statement, I am called a liar. If anyone here at NV knows anything about me at all, it is this: This column is called 'Straight Talk' for a reason. I give it to you straight. If I don't know, I tell you so. If I have an opinion, I give it. But I don't lie to people.

                Unfortunately, I have deleted iarnuocon's endless links to Jesus Toast and Faces in the Clouds, which were in his last comment, and also placed him on the 'ignored' list.

                I don't mind if people disagree with me, but when they start calling me a liar on my own column...that's it, baby. You are outta here and don't let the door hit you on the way out.

                A year with Newsvine, over 120 articles, and this is only the second ignore/deletion I have ever had to do.

                {"commentId":1398392,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                • 4 votes
                #13.4 - Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:33 PM EST
                {"commentId":1398881,"authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
                iarnuoconRestored

                I have NEVER said I knew what the object is. That would be ridiculous. Nevertheless, you are certainly selling a specific take on it, despite the careful insertion of "nobody knows." It's "an anomaly" (but it's not, really), it's "mysterious" (except that it's ordinary), it raises the question "where did we REALLY come from?" (except that it doesn't raise that question, at all). Does that make you a liar? Only you would know. All I know is that with the same breath that you claim neutrality, you try to couch this image as some great mystery.

                Unfortunately, I have deleted iarnuocon's endless links to Jesus Toast and Faces in the Clouds, which were in his last comment, and also placed him on the 'ignored' list. Well, from where I sit, it doesn't look like that deletion took. But if you'd care to try it, I'll happily ask the Newsvine staff to restore it, and don't much doubt that they will do so, given that it is completely on topic. And I'd say that your willingness to delete "straight talk" that backs up what it says with evidence says quite a bit about you, Robert.

                I don't mind if people disagree with me, but when they start calling me a liar on my own column...that's it, baby. You are outta here and don't let the door hit you on the way out. Get over yourself, already. I didn't say anything that I wouldn't say to your face. If you don't want people to doubt your neutrality, stop intimating that this is proof of alien handiwork.

                You can ignore me all you like. It won't make anything I said any less on point.

                {"commentId":1398881,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
                • 3 votes
                #13.5 - Thu Jan 24, 2008 9:45 PM EST
                {"commentId":1399170,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                iarnuocon: If you absolutely, positively know what it is, why haven't you posted an article about it? You seem to think it can be written off as a picture in a cloud or seeing Jesus in a piece of toast, which shows you basically as an arrogant know-it-all. Your information bit on your column really says it all:

                'All ye mighty: behold my opinions, and despair.'

                Right. Bet you have a lot of friends. (not)

                You haven't any proof about what the anomaly (and YES, it is an anomaly) is either. Like everyone else, you haven't enough solid information to make a judgment. So please stop shouting down from the rooftops that you do.

                The reference to 'where did we come from' was more satire than anything else.

                One last thing: I can't make you do it, but I'd prefer you take your business elsewhere.

                {"commentId":1399170,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                • 2 votes
                #13.6 - Thu Jan 24, 2008 11:32 PM EST
                {"commentId":1399229,"authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}

                If you absolutely, positively know what it is, why haven't you posted an article about it? Because it doesn't deserve any more press than you and about half a dozen other Newsviners have given it? "News bulletin: scientists discover rock on Mars. More details at 11:00!"

                You seem to think it can be written off as a picture in a cloud or seeing Jesus in a piece of toast, which shows you basically as an arrogant know-it-all. Yes, the truly open-minded and humble will view it as proof that we're descended from Martians. Thank you.

                Right. Bet you have a lot of friends. (not) You're a veritable fount of knowledge, eh?

                You haven't any proof about what the anomaly (and YES, it is an anomaly) is either. Seriously, it's not an anomaly.

                The reference to 'where did we come from' was more satire than anything else. Sure. Ok.

                One last thing: I can't make you do it, but I'd prefer you take your business elsewhere. We all have preferences, don't we?

                {"commentId":1399229,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
                • 2 votes
                #13.7 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 12:02 AM EST
                Reply
                {"commentId":1395104,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

                So Bigfoot is a shorty now?

                {"commentId":1395104,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
                  Reply#14 - Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:50 PM EST
                  {"commentId":1395457,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                  TJ sez:

                  "So Bigfoot is a shorty now?"

                  Or it's a rock, or a carving, or a lava flow, or whatever. No one really knows, but since the atmosphere of Mars wouldn't support Earth mammals, I think we can count out Bigfoot...

                  {"commentId":1395457,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                  • 4 votes
                  Reply#15 - Thu Jan 24, 2008 4:04 AM EST
                  {"commentId":1395979,"authorDomain":"nearing"}
                  ...I think we can count out Bigfoot...

                  Besides, wasn't Bigfoot supposed to be male? ;>}

                  {"commentId":1395979,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"nearing"}
                    Reply#16 - Thu Jan 24, 2008 9:58 AM EST
                    {"commentId":1396940,"authorDomain":"Griff69"}

                    True, this figure is definitely female. You can tell because she's wearing a skirt.

                    {"commentId":1396940,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"Griff69"}
                    • 2 votes
                    #16.1 - Thu Jan 24, 2008 1:53 PM EST
                    {"commentId":1401696,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

                    It's conversations like this that remind me why public education has failed miserably.

                    {"commentId":1401696,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
                      #16.2 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 5:04 PM EST
                      {"commentId":1402230,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                      TJ: You said THIS, in place of a real response to the article:

                      "So Bigfoot is a shorty now?"

                      Don't blame it on the public education system. The one I went to was pretty darn good.

                      {"commentId":1402230,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                      • 2 votes
                      #16.3 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 7:26 PM EST
                      {"commentId":1402609,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

                      That was one of many responses, and compulsory education is not in the Constitution.

                      {"commentId":1402609,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
                        #16.4 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 9:27 PM EST
                        {"commentId":1403582,"authorDomain":"acidreflux"}

                        Yes, the Constitution does guarantee you the right to make a fool of yourself in public. In that you are correct.

                        {"commentId":1403582,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"acidreflux"}
                          #16.5 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 8:45 AM EST
                          Reply
                          {"commentId":1399250,"authorDomain":"silkmesh"}

                          Two grown men arguing one of you best stop answering the others comments then the argument ceases. I find nothing wrong with this article or the way it has been presented. I am sure most readers of the article and the title will know any reason against it are very unfounded. We know who is very, very wrong. We also know who has show himself to be very silly. Remember gentlemen to read the white text on the green bar under the Enter Your Comments box. Both of you are very good writers and it is embarrassing to see an argument that could have been stopped at the first bad comment. With a simple "I beg to differ on your opinion of your comment, I am sure other viners and joe public, will know the truth of the matter" In this case we certainly do.

                          {"commentId":1399250,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"silkmesh"}
                          • 2 votes
                          Reply#17 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 12:13 AM EST
                          {"commentId":1400446,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                          I discussed this article with the staff of AB this morning. We've all seen the comments, etc. Greg (our techie guy from Microsoft) encouraged me to restore the comments and 'un-ignore' ianuocon, so I did this. We're not big on censorship around here.

                          I also think Babel Fish makes a lot of sense.

                          When we first composed the article, of course we were fully prepared to debunk the whole thing, such as ianuocon did. But looking at the picture, it's hard to dismiss it as nothing. Sure, it could be a rock. What is it? We don't know. If we did, we'd be working at NASA analyzing photographs.

                          Do we think it's an alien? Absolutely not. It's obviously made of stone. Could it be a natural phenomenon, caused by eons of blowing dust storms on Mars? Yes. Could it be a long-ago sculpture created by some ancient Martian civilization? Maybe...but the odds are against it, of course. Does ANYONE know with 100% certainty what it is? NO.

                          The staff at AB has an admittedly inordinate interest in the Red Planet. We support efforts to land humans there. On our front office wall is a framed picture three feet wide of the famous 'Twin Peaks' image from Pathfinder. We did a book about a first mission to Mars where the main character was based on Canadian Chief Astronaut Julie Payette, and Payette liked the book. (she received a copy in hardback) The John H Chapman Space Centre put copies into their library.

                          But that book was a REALISTIC look at Mars, and we are not given to flights of fancy, although we do wonder (like many others) if some of the theories about Mars that have been forwarded by others might be true. Such as...

                          There were once shallow seas on Mars comprised of H2O. That Mars once had an atmosphere thicker than now. And yes...that at some time in the far past intelligent life MAY have existed there. But these are nothing but theories, and have yet to be proven.

                          Unlike ionuocon, we can't just write off possibilities. The image does say one thing to us: Sooner or later, a personal visit to the Red Planet by human beings is a good idea.

                          The main reason everyone here at AB became angry with ianuocon was because we objected to his allegations that we had some sort of hidden agenda by posting the article.

                          Well, it's not like we were the first to post up about it. We just happened to have the original image saved from the first release of it by NASA some years ago, and you can be assured we were as surprised as anyone else when we actually saw this whatever-it-is in the photograph. Until that point, everyone here assumed that the pictures released by the English newspaper were simply photoshopped images. So, yeah...it was a shock. We still agree that NASA should either issue a detailed public report, or send Spirit back for a second look.

                          {"commentId":1400446,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                          • 3 votes
                          Reply#18 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 11:27 AM EST
                          {"commentId":1400775,"authorDomain":"iammage492"}

                          Look at the second image from the top. Near the top of this image there are holes in the ground, they are at a distance and are a lighter color, as you proceed down the shadows become darker. This "statue" is near the middle of the picture and it's shadow is about half way between the two extremes in shadowing, this is not including the deeper holes which would naturally be darker.

                          Now, take a look at the bottom picture. Do you see the rock that it is sitting on? It is in fact NOT sitting on that rock, but behind it. What you are seeing is shadowing from a hole in the ground which shadows differ creating the illusion of being a 3d convex image because it is differing in levels.

                          My friends, what you have here is a Face-Vace.

                          {"commentId":1400775,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iammage492"}
                          • 1 vote
                          Reply#19 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 12:54 PM EST
                          {"commentId":1402222,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                          As good a theory as any other...

                          Basically, there isn't enough information available to make a 100% conclusive statement about it. I'm sure someone will figure out the answer sooner or later.

                          {"commentId":1402222,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                          • 1 vote
                          #19.1 - Fri Jan 25, 2008 7:24 PM EST
                          Reply
                          {"commentId":1403266,"authorDomain":"ronaldgash"}

                          This is a very interesting picture. But you know how NASA is, they will probably airbrush the picture and say it's nothing but rocks and shadows without doing any further investigating.

                          {"commentId":1403266,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"ronaldgash"}
                          • 2 votes
                          Reply#20 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 3:13 AM EST
                          {"commentId":1403279,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

                          They probably know what it is and are laughing at us for not.

                          {"commentId":1403279,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
                            #20.1 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 3:26 AM EST
                            {"commentId":1404179,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                            Ron Gash says:

                            "This is a very interesting picture. But you know how NASA is, they will probably airbrush the picture and say it's nothing but rocks and shadows without doing any further investigating."

                            We thought of that too, Ron. But it wouldn't work. When the image was first made available in 2004, downloads from the NASA site were massive. It's WAY too late for them to even try that one...

                            {"commentId":1404179,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                            • 2 votes
                            #20.2 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 12:57 PM EST
                            Reply
                            {"commentId":1403888,"authorDomain":"mwestenfelder"}

                            Well, if Marsians can be so stupid to put a statue in the Middle of nowhere, we won't have to be afraid. The last who did that were the Soviets and we all know what happened to them.

                            {"commentId":1403888,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"mwestenfelder"}
                            • 1 vote
                            Reply#21 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 11:08 AM EST
                            {"commentId":1405295,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

                            LOL

                            {"commentId":1405295,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
                              #21.1 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 9:23 PM EST
                              {"commentId":1505347,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                              That REALLY made sense. If you consider the advancement of ignorance to be a virtue.

                              {"commentId":1505347,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                              • 1 vote
                              #21.2 - Mon Feb 25, 2008 4:55 AM EST
                              Reply
                              {"commentId":1404022,"authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}

                              Dude, if you're going to use my handle in the captions to your photos, you could at least have enough journalistic integrity to spell it correctly. Is it that hard? I mean, c'mon, you don't know how to cut and paste, even?

                              It's not "ionuocon"
                              It's not "ianuocon"
                              and it's not "iuonuocon"

                              You can't locate an "r" when it's right in front of you, but I'm somehow supposed to take your "analysis" of this photo seriously? Good job, Roberf Bleeving - AE of Seanie... lol

                              Oh, and you might try actually showing some other shadows from "the surrounding terrain" if you're going to expect people to make comparisons. Ah, screw it, why bother? That'd just get in the way of "objectivity."

                              {"commentId":1404022,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
                              • 2 votes
                              Reply#22 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 12:01 PM EST
                              {"commentId":1404189,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                              It was about the PICTURE. Not you. We apologize for the misspelling. You could go with an easier moniker, you know. (chuckles)

                              The staff here wonders why there is zero information about you on your column...that is your right, of course. But we were wondering. Maybe you analyze photos for the space program, maybe you are a scientist? If so, maybe you should say so. We'd have a lot more respect for your opinions if we had some idea of your experience in scientific matters.

                              As far as objectivity, we just presented the image. Anyone can download the big image from JPL and take a look at it, expand it, make up their own minds, whatever. We weren't even the first to do it.

                              {"commentId":1404189,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                              • 3 votes
                              #22.1 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 1:00 PM EST
                              {"commentId":1404392,"authorDomain":"acidreflux"}

                              You are starting to make the Ron Paul supporters look sane by comparison.

                              I'm upping my position in the tinfoil industry, I think.

                              {"commentId":1404392,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"acidreflux"}
                              • 1 vote
                              #22.2 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 2:48 PM EST
                              {"commentId":1404753,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

                              We support Obama. (chuckles)

                              Look, we saw the story in the English newspaper and decided to look at the image for ourselves. You can't take some of our theories about it seriously. No one REALLY knows what it is, although we will admit it is likely some sort of natural phenomenon. Strange one, indeed. If I were a betting man, I'd have to bet it is natural. But, we enjoyed joking a bit about it.

                              {"commentId":1404753,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}
                              • 2 votes
                              #22.3 - Sat Jan 26, 2008 5:07 PM EST
                              {"commentId":1414459,"authorDomain":"sphinx"}
                              Strange one, indeed. If I were a betting man, I'd have to bet it is natural. But, we enjoyed joking a bit about it.

                              Interesting, so repeatedly intimating artificial origins and thinly veiled support for wildly speculative cries of "OMFG, Martians!" falls under the realm of "joking."

                              Duly noted.

                              {"commentId":1414459,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"sphinx"}
                              • 1 vote
                              #22.4 - Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:05 PM EST
                              Reply
                              {"commentId":1407032,"authorDomain":"bqruloff"}

                              The landers on Mars, especially the Rovers, are designed for finding artifacts, such as an old brick wall, broken statuary, household items and so on. At the South Pole, beyond any doubt, there are very large trees, survivors of an ecosystem ravaged by floods, which carved the water channels on Mars. The entire ecosystem was like the earth's, and if trees survived, then insects that burrow in trees survived, and there were higher forms of animal life. Did intelligence evolve? It looks like there are carved "Faces" on Mars, and it is enormously easy for NASA to turn the rover around and go right back to this and do a photo study from a distance of six feet or less . It is far too important not to. We n eed landers and rovers near the trees growing from the dunes, The Face, and so on

                              {"commentId":1407032,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"bqruloff"}
                              • 1 vote
                              Reply#23 - Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:09 PM EST
                              {"commentId":1410077,"authorDomain":"bqruloff"}

                              Had there been a rational space program, we would already have a permanently manned base on the Moon, and then, yes, already, manned bases on the two moons of Mars. Despite the long travel time, it would be enormously easy to have already sent on ahead, to the two Martian moons, tremendous amounts of supplies in unmanned vehicles that would gently settle onto the moons' surfaces. From these vantage points, rovers could be driven by radio in real time all over the surface. (Remember, the first possible landing dates were btwn 1980 and 1984, had it been an Apollo-Saturn follow-on project.) The initial landers could have been sterilized to avoid contamination by and destruction of Mars' organism. Examination of soil samples could have been done in Mars-space before bringing them back to earth. Instead we have a near useless "space shuttle", now being abandoned, in favor of an enhanced Apollo capsule, to land again on the Moon, as though it never happened the first time. The psychology of all this was best expressed by Lyndon Johnson, who was put in charge of the manned space program, who said, famously, that the American people were so ill-informed and so unwise that after all this marvelous technology had been developed, launched and proven out, that they'd just p--- it all down the drain. How right he was.

                              To me it appears that a civilization on some level was wiped out. The Saganistic view that extraordinary views require extraordinary proof is total rubbish, as was a good deal of the science commentary of this weak-kneed Liberace of astrophysics. Certain chemicals become amino acids in interstellar space, so they will also on planetary surfaces, and evolution will occur. This evolution will eventually result in "intelligence" that works tools, constructs buildings, fights wars and so on. Intelligences permeate the universe but are stranded from each other by inconceivable distances until we develop Star Trek - style technology, but right now the evidence lays heavily on the side of those who argue we have the ruins of a civilization on a neighboring planet that at least functioned on the level of ancient Rome or ancient Egypt.

                              {"commentId":1410077,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"bqruloff"}
                              • 2 votes
                              Reply#24 - Mon Jan 28, 2008 12:24 PM EST
                              {"commentId":1411424,"authorDomain":"drymouse"}

                              It saddens me to read this article. What seemingly was a simple question about a picture, spilled into a lesson of futility of close mindedness. I am of the opinion, that everyone can have their opinion. And, it is their right to speak that opinion. I also feel that healthy debate is good for discovering all aspects of a topic such as this as long as that debate does not resort to name calling. We have the right to agree to disagree.

                              With that said, this picture does spark some debate as to its origins. I am a "see it to believe it" type. There is not enough information to say for sure, and more investigation will easily divulge the mystery from speculation. If we did not investigate things which warrant it, then discovery would be vastly stunted. We would never invent things nor go down the path less traveled. Why bother, it is obviously a path not worth taking, otherwise it would be well traveled, right?

                              As for iarnuocon, I like to keep an open mind about things, but not so open my brain falls out. Like I said before, I need proof of existence, but I am not willing to discount a mystery when I see one. You seem to be very black and white with nothing in-between. What troubles me is you have a certain amount of faith about some subjects, but that faith does not extend to others. You blindly believe that God created everything, even though there is no hard evidence that he/she/it really does exist; yet this faith does not extend to the fact that this could be something more than a rock formation. Doesn't the uncertainty warrant a second look? Even if it turns out to be a rock formation, at the very least answers the question of uncertainty and at most something of interest could be found upon closer inspection. Perhaps some frozen H2O, who knows. Before you get your razor wit out to debunk the H2O, that was just an example.

                              I don't know that God exists, aliens have visited our planet or continue to visit our planet, or that this is a simple rock formation made from ancient volcanic lava flows; but, there is enough evidence to support the theory and warrant further investigation until we know for fact what they are. Who knows, there could be a whole race of God entities who live outside time and space, and our universe is but a science experiment for one of them. Simpson's did it :P

                              {"commentId":1411424,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"drymouse"}
                              • 1 vote
                              Reply#25 - Mon Jan 28, 2008 6:49 PM EST
                              {"commentId":1411604,"authorDomain":"tjthompson"}

                              Why would an omniscient God need to "experiment"?

                              {"commentId":1411604,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"tjthompson"}
                                #25.1 - Mon Jan 28, 2008 7:42 PM EST
                                {"commentId":1411757,"authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}

                                You seem to be very black and white with nothing in-between. What troubles me is you have a certain amount of faith about some subjects, but that faith does not extend to others. You blindly believe that God created everything, even though there is no hard evidence that he/she/it really does exist; yet this faith does not extend to the fact that this could be something more than a rock formation. Excuse me? As unlikely as it might seem, you must have the wrong "iarnuocon."

                                this could be something more than a rock formation. Doesn't the uncertainty warrant a second look? Quoting you, I like to keep an open mind, but not so open that my brains fall out. Sure, all things being equal, go take a second look. In my opinion, however, all things don't appear to be equal, and I'd have a hard time, were I working for NASA, justifying rerouting the rover back to ground that it has already covered, simply because some fairly credulous people could kind-of-sort-of-maybe-possibly be a "statue" (if you toss out reason, common sense, experience, and any knowledge of the human propensity to see stuff that isn't there); especially if that rerouting means that we have to forgo exploring new and unexplored territory that might, as you say, contain something novel and interesting, such as H2O, bacterial life, or Marvin preparing his iludium Q38 space modulator.

                                In light of the limited resources we have for exploring Mars, I don't think this warrants a second look, as it is amply explained by natural processes, and because there is nothing suggesting that it is anything other than a natural rock formation, even despite the fact that it resembles an anthropomorphic figure.

                                As many times as I've explained this, I'm not sure how anyone could mistake my meaning. I've been pretty straightforward about what I believe regarding this rock, and why I believe it. In response, I've seen histrionics, paper think skin, censorship, ad hominem attacks, veiled and not-so-veiled comments speculating as to my employment, personal life, et cetera, and unconvincing excuses (made well after this article went stale) that the assertion that this might be a "Martian artifact" were "satire" and a joke.

                                But somehow I'm the close-minded person. There's a one word description for that sort of behavior-- "bull@!$%#." And I say this without being mad about it. I don't know Robert other than from his writings-- some of his stuff I like, some I simply ignore. I'm sure he's a pleasant enough fellow in person, and if we were having this discussion over a beer at the pub, we'd probably find a lot more common ground than not.

                                That said, I don't think there's any mystery about this rock, and nothing that's been presented so far makes me think it is anything other than what I describe it as-- people reading too much into a natural formation. When I see an actual mystery, I'll give it all due consideration.

                                {"commentId":1411757,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
                                • 4 votes
                                #25.2 - Mon Jan 28, 2008 8:37 PM EST
                                {"commentId":1413532,"authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}

                                Edit: "some fairly credulous people [think this] could..."

                                {"commentId":1413532,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"iarnuocon"}
                                • 2 votes
                                #25.3 - Tue Jan 29, 2008 10:59 AM EST
                                {"commentId":1414182,"authorDomain":"drymouse"}

                                Fair enough :)

                                {"commentId":1414182,"threadId":"207242","contentId":"1248372","authorDomain":"drymouse"}
                                  #25.4 - Tue Jan 29, 2008 2:02 PM EST
                                  Reply
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